Mt. Defiance 12-18-14

[raven]

I suspect the two blazes depicted have different histories. As I understand the historic blaze pattern, four horizontal saw cuts were made, dot over dash, with the centers of the dot and dash made by chipping out the bark. No effort made to cut wood, apart from the center of the saw cuts on the curved trunk.

The first first picture looks as though someone removed wood to refresh an old blaze:



The second blaze was a literal hatchet job:



Neither seems to be to an FS standard.

[pablo]

Folks who have not been up there might want to read the TR I posted in October http://www.portlandhikers.org/forum/vie ... 7&p=150385. There are new signs, extensive jumbo sized cairns, blaze, tread work, trimming of trees. Not your usual rogue maintenance. One crappy blaze out of 15-20 does not mean a FS contract crew didn't do this. And the FS will chop into trees as they've done on the old Vista Trail next to where they nailed wilderness boundary signs.

I PM'ed Edan so maybe we can get an official ruling on this.

--Paul

[Jack]

Thanks, Paul. Moral of the story is: “Don’t miss a trip report.” The temporary sign does seem like a sure indicator, alright. I hadn’t been up there since early August when no work had been done at all, so I was quite surprised to see any, as I’m sure you were, too. Now, some of the cairn posts are no longer standing, because of the wind storms, I assume.

[Don Nelsen]

Hi!

Thank you for your report.
I actually have a question regarding your track. Like most of the Defiance reports and topo guides on the internet, it looks like the Starvation Ridge takes the trails 414 and 417 to attain the top. However, nobody seems to ONLY use 414 trail, the actual designated Starvation Ridge, why so ?
I have actually hiked it myself and couldn't find the junction between 414 and 417, does it exist ? is the topo map wrong ?did I miss it ?

I hope my question was clear. Attached is the section that I am talking about

I've tried to find that connecter too, but found nothing but game trails from either side. The lower side has a good game trail that goes for a short distance as Jack has already mentioned but it peters out and there is no indication of any man-made trail anywhere. The headwall on the top side has a maze of game trails, but again, no indication of a man made trail there either. This isn't the first map error but it has given us some entertaining exploring expeditions.

dn

(edit: typos)

[Eric Peterson]

Since then, I read a Mazamas article saying this route was used on snow, only.

This makes the most sense yet! But wouldn't the FS have blazed the overland snow route, if they did would
the blazes be over grown by now?

I've also had a little poke around the alleged trail junction, had Mayhem with me so I didn't get to far
as he preferred to stay on trail.

Jack, it sounds like you and your son pretty much did the whole alignment?

[totops1]

Hi!

Thank you for your report.
I actually have a question regarding your track. Like most of the Defiance reports and topo guides on the internet, it looks like the Starvation Ridge takes the trails 414 and 417 to attain the top. However, nobody seems to ONLY use 414 trail, the actual designated Starvation Ridge, why so ?
I have actually hiked it myself and couldn't find the junction between 414 and 417, does it exist ? is the topo map wrong ?did I miss it ?

I hope my question was clear. Attached is the section that I am talking about

I've tried to find that connecter too, but found nothing but game trails from either side. The lower side has a good game trail that goes for a short distance as Jack has already mentioned but it peters out and there is not indication of any man-made trail anywhere. The headwall on the top side has a maze of game trails, but again, no indication of a man made trail there either. This isn't the first map error by it has given us some entertaining exploring expeditions.

dn

Thanks everybody for your answers. I was going to go and search for myself even though I haven't found a GPS track that uses this "ghost" trail #414.

[Eric Peterson]

Hi Totops, I've got that ghost segment loaded into the mapset I've been compiling, marked as old/abandoned. Must have been included in some USGS data as I didn't manually include it.

If you're using a Garmin and savvy, download from the link in my signature. At the very least you can see
the mapset in Basecamp

[totops1]

Hi Eric,
Thanks for your input, it's definitely helpful to know that it's an abandoned trail.
Now, I'm sorry for asking that and it's off topic but what is Basecamp, is it the Garmin equivalent of National Topo! ?
and what is a mapset ?

thanks again!

[pablo]

Nice report and photos.

I wonder who did the hatchet job? [...]

I was up there in October and saw this blaze, several large rock cairns with posts in the middle, and new signs here and there. I got the impression it was all done to spec so I assumed at the time it was a Forest Service crew that blazed the trees.

I have an "official" response - I'm checking to see if I can post the exact quote. The work was done under the direction of Mt Hood RD with the purpose of making the trail easier to follow due to the numbers of folks losing their way between Warren Lake and Defiance Trail - included blazes, cairns, and other maintenance.

Another tidbit - according to the reply I received that trail on USGS TOPO maps branching off Starvation Ridge and heading up towards Warren Lake never existed. I'm not surprised.

--Paul

[Jack]

Thanks, Paul. It’s nice to know the blazes were done officially and not independently. Something tells me people with no navigation skills will still get lost, though. Thanks, too, for an official conclusion to any hopes of a mysterious long lost trail.