When all of a sudden there arose such a clatter....

[R11]

Since the Hillsboro Airshow runs this weekend I thought I'd post up this short clip of a fighter jet from some video I shot up above The Necklace Valley in the Alpine Lakes Wilderness several years ago. Any aircraft aficionados want to take a stab? F-18 Hornet maybe?

http://youtu.be/NRYiRAjimP0


ron

[raven]

Video is marked as private, requiring a login.

[R11]

Oops! How about now?


ron

[raven]

URL works now. I think you are correct -- an F-18, flying too low over a Wilderness Area.

[retired jerry]

Nice you got it on video.

I've had planes fly over me in the wilderness before, very startling. They must figure it's okay because no one's there

[R11]

URL works now. I think you are correct -- an F-18, flying too low over a Wilderness Area.

It is a little surprising how they train in those valleys like that. The next day as I was sitting in my camp I saw another one come snaking over the col between Summit Chief and Chimney Peak and bank even lower down into the same valley out of my sight before climbing back out at the head wall.

One other time probably 15 years ago I was with some friends hiking up the slabs just below Robin Lakes on the other side of Mt Daniel when we saw two come side by side up the Hyas Lake valley a bit below us and on up over Deception pass. People have mentioned in threads at NWHikers that they've seen them up around Glacier Peak in the Lyman Lakes area as too...


ron

[R11]

Nice you got it on video.

I've had planes fly over me in the wilderness before, very startling. They must figure it's okay because no one's there

Yeah, it can be a little startling since they're relatively quiet until they get close and then when they pass you it's super loud


ron

[retired jerry]

And then after they leave there's this echoing, then very quiet.

[raven]

I looked up the laws on the use of low-level training flights over wilderness areas. (I've been meaning to read the rules for years.)

A private pilot has to stay 2000' minimum over a wilderness area. All aircraft are normally limited to 250 knots indicated air speed below 10000' above sea level for see and avoid reasons in continental U.S. airspace. Exemptions exist for military flightsunder specific conditions, such as air shows or aircraft that require higher speeds, but normally the military has to fit in with other traffic. So the low-level flights over wildernesses would seem as though they are mere arrogance -- but there are different rules for military training flights...

The military has low-level training routes in shared airspace; population centers are avoided. Flights must be subsonic and within, I think, 10 nautical miles of the centerline of the published route. I'm not sure, but there may be no ground clearance distance requirement apart from see and avoid. The military has to provide at least a 2 hour warning via the FAA when a low-level training route is to be used. There is a military exemption for training flights over wildernesses, and there are published low-level routes over the North Cascades. So military jets can legally dust your mountain goat at 600 mph, but they cannot give you a photo op of a sonic boom generating a rainbow in the fur of the tumbling goat.

The rules do not relieve the military of general responsibility for safe operations. So, if a pilot does something that seems dangerous, complain to Whidbey Island NAS as the probable controlling facility. The controlling facility should be aware of which flight operations are or were in the area at any given time and the FAA should have a record of the issued NOTAM (notice to airmen). Safety assures only one flight operation is cleared at a time, although multiple aircraft may be involved, so specific pilots can be identified if the time and location of an incident are known.

[retired jerry]

They're probably practicing for military actions, like in Afganistan, where they fly low to avoid fire and hug the terrain.