Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

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Pnw.hiker
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Pnw.hiker » October 15th, 2012, 7:36 pm

Did a long trip this spring with a homemade wood burning stove. It was so dangerous I actually quit using it. Scared the heck out of me. Way more dangerous than an alcohol stove. Works great if there's a handy fire ring and no wind. Otherwise the sparks fly.

Alcohol stoves are just a little lighter than canister stoves, all things considered, if you're cooking the same thing with the same cookware. But they lend themselves to a minimalist cookset and menu, if you're willing, which can go much lighter.

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Rabid Swan
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Rabid Swan » October 18th, 2012, 11:07 am

Lumpy wrote:I believe the cat can stove is a little safer than the Pepsi can stoves because they do not allow the pot to sit on top, so the pot stand can be made to be sturdy.
I have used both the pop can stove and cat stove and definitely prefer the cat can stove because it doesn't require a pot stand. I'm not sure how you guys set up your stove, but this was my set up under ideal conditions this summer. I haven't had issues with stability. Having a short wide pot helps, but isn't necessary. Sometimes it takes a few minutes of improvising to find a safe and sturdy cooking area usually by finding sandy areas or a flat rock to set the stove on.

Image

I've been alternating between a cat stove and a Bushbuddy wood stove depending on where/how long I'm out hiking. I don't think anyone has mentioned the bushbuddy on this thread and I just want to plug in on how much I love it. The bushbuddy weighs in at about 5.5 oz and is brilliantly designed. It's a double walled chamber that keeps the fire completely off the ground leaving no burn marks. Holes on the bottom pull air in like a candles convection, but it also uses the outer chamber to bring some of that air to the middle of the flame. This double combustion without any moving parts makes for a very efficient and clean flame and also centers the flame under the pot.

Image

The wood you see in the picture was enough to boil a full liter of water. It takes a little bit of prep work to snap twigs and start the fire, but I have been lacking in my fire starting ability and really appreciate the practice especially in wet conditions. I know some people with this stove who use it to cook rice, lentils and quinoa. Without the fuel constraint you can actually cook as long as you want instead of just boiling water.

Lumpy
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Lumpy » October 18th, 2012, 11:40 am

Here is the cat can design I'm using:
http://royrobinson.homestead.com/Cat_Stove.html

Flame exits the top, not from holes on the side. Uses a put stand.
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Koda
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Koda » October 18th, 2012, 6:22 pm

the fun part about this thread is all the options. Its good to have so many options available, and especially if you can't afford the latest titanium jetboil or other there are lighter options that cost a fraction and some you can make your own. At least now, not having a good working stove is no longer anything to complain about :)

I have a Jetboil SOL, an old and reliable Whisperlite and a Brunton Raptor canister stove. The Raptor I'm not using because its not as efficient and fast as the Jetboil and does not work as well in wind or winter. I'm keeping the whisperlite though, and still debate which is best vs. the SOL.... it may weigh only a tiny bit more and I don't have to deal with 3/4 empty canisters. I've been using the Jetboil though because hands down it is the fastest to setup and boil.... I need my coffee like NOW in the mornings :) Seriously though, I'm considering going back to the whisperlite simply over the 3/4 empty canister issue.

Now back to the alcohol stoves.... At some point it would be a fun project to make my own. I'm also intrigued by the wood stoves, but am skeptical about their practicality especially in wet conditions, still the solo stove looks great, but then the Vargo ti stove is super light on its own.
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Koda
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Koda » October 18th, 2012, 6:51 pm

Actually, this thread has sparked an idea.

If anyone know a web link to instructions for making your own alcohol or wood stove that will fit inside a GSI Halulite Minimalist mug (4.20" x 4.20" x 4.60) I would be grateful.
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Pnw.hiker
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Pnw.hiker » October 19th, 2012, 4:37 am

Koda wrote:Actually, this thread has sparked an idea.

If anyone know a web link to instructions for making your own alcohol or wood stove that will fit inside a GSI Halulite Minimalist mug (4.20" x 4.20" x 4.60) I would be grateful.
Stove, no problem. Here's the classic version.
Potstand/windscreen, a little tricky to make. See ZenStoves for some examples.

Here's a 4" I.D. pot. (4oz total, wrap parts in a small towelette to stop rattling.)
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sparklehorse
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by sparklehorse » October 19th, 2012, 10:08 am

I tried the Bushbuddy a few years ago. I agree with Rabid Swan that it's well designed. It's very well made too, a nice piece of kit. The idea of not having to carry fuel is very nice. I really wanted to like the Bushbuddy, but in practice I just didn't. At the end of a long day of hiking I typically just want to make a meal quickly and simply. I found the process of gathering the wood, prepping it, getting the fire going, keeping it going, etc, to be more than I really wanted to deal with, especially in wet conditions. Plus there's the issue of soot. The stove itself stays pretty clean, but the pot gets very sooty. It's an added chore to keep the pot semi-clean, or at least to try to contain the mess so it doesn't get soot on other things in your pack. So I went back to alcohol stoves and haven't looked back. For the past two years I've been using the very light and compact Snow Peak 600 mug in tandem with Trail Designs' SP-600 ULC Cone and their pop can stove:

Image

Image

Everything fits inside the little mug except the ti stakes:

Image

This whole cookset weighs less than 5 ounces (not counting fuel). Plus I love the compactness of it.

I much prefer this setup over canister stoves or cat cans, which I've also tried.

YMMV

G
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Rabid Swan
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Rabid Swan » October 19th, 2012, 10:55 am

sparklehorse - You're right about the soot issues. It took a while to make a habit of not touching the bottom of the pot. There have been many times where i forget about the soot and smudge "war paint" all over my face. :lol: I consider the bushbuddy to be the backpacking version of slow food vs fast food. If I'm putting down heavy miles or getting to camp late I use the alcohol stove, but if i have leisurely evenings I enjoy the involved cooking process including the ability to simmer over the coals to fully cook my food. Some day I'll try the caldera cone. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

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Koda
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by Koda » October 19th, 2012, 12:29 pm

good info, thanks for the link PNWHiker and the details Sparklehorse.
sparklehorse wrote: Image

This whole cookset weighs less than 5 ounces (not counting fuel). Plus I love the compactness of it.
the little bottle, for the fuel I'm assuming... can you tell me how much fuel you bring in ounces and how long it lasts (8oz boils)?
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sparklehorse
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Re: Canister vs. Alcohol Stove

Post by sparklehorse » October 19th, 2012, 3:14 pm

Koda wrote:the little bottle, for the fuel I'm assuming... can you tell me how much fuel you bring in ounces and how long it lasts (8oz boils)?
Sorry, that little bottle only holds an ounce or two of fuel, I probably should've left it out of the picture. I usually carry my alcohol in a plastic travel flask similar to these:

http://shop.wineinterview.com/8049-plas ... flask.html

My stove/mug/cone combo will usually boil 2 cups of water on less than an ounce of fuel. Might need a bit more if it's windy. That's using 190 proof Everclear. You'll typically need a little more if you're using a methanol product like HEET. In general I plan on 1-ounce of fuel per meal, plus a little extra just in case. For a four day trip I'd bring 7-8 ounces of fuel. Less if I was going to eat a cold meal or two.

Another good carry option I've tried is a small soda bottle, like an 8 or 10 ounce size, maybe 12 ounce. You're in business if you can find a pour cap like this:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin ... -caps.html

(Platys have the same threads as many soda bottles)

I've read the pour cap from a hot sauce bottle will work on a soda bottle. I haven't tried it though:

http://www.amazon.com/Huy-Fong-Sriracha ... B0002PSOJW

Here's another good option, their little plastic measuring jigger is especially helpful:

http://www.traildesigns.com/accessories/fuel-bottle-kit

Hope that helps.

G
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You have to milk the cow a lot to make a bit of cheese.
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